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What Causes Lightheadedness, Drooling And Weakness In Knees?
Question: Hello, I hope you can help. We just started having symptoms from a fume or chemical reaction but can't figure out what it is. The symptoms include: lightheadedness (as if you get high), drool from the side of the mouth, weakness in the knees, shaking hands, memory loss, tightness in the chest, and chemical taste in the mouth after a period of exposure. The owner of the house in which I work had his fireplace replaced and now we can't get rid of the issue.
If we leave the room, we are fine. If we stay in there longer than a minute, the issues start. Even with the windows open. Any ideas?
If we leave the room, we are fine. If we stay in there longer than a minute, the issues start. Even with the windows open. Any ideas?
Brief Answer:
Fire Dept.- Health Dept.- Gas Company Most Indicated
Detailed Answer:
Good afternoon. My name is Dr. Saghafi and I am a neurologist from XXXXXXX Ohio. Sorry to hear you're having these sorts of issues. You say that PECO (I'm not sure what the acronym stands for) and the Fire Dept. have reviewed the premises but not found CO.
However, in my opinion they would be the ultimate authorities for the job of either finding the cause of this problem in this house or at least verifying that something toxic is present and to implement actions to remedy the situation. Obviously, from a medical or neurological point of view nobody should be in this environment until it has been cleared and the problem corrected. Perhaps, the State has a HAZMAT Dept. that can be dispatched to the premisis if the other authorities can't think of anything? Of course, I'm sure nobody is going to make you go back in the house unless it's been cleared. How about the EPA?
As far as what the substance is causing these symptoms it almost certainly is NOT carbon monoxide (CO). Typically, that substance will make people lightheaded, dizzy, and nauseous or suffer with what is taken to be flu like symptoms but drooling, chest tightness, or complaints of chemical tastes in the mouth are not part of the common clinical presentation. Though CO is naturally an odorless gas typically, the smell of natural gas in a room always implies the presence of CO.
The one substance that comes to my mind when you talk about drooling and chest tightness, and shakiness in the hands, weakness in the knees, would be substances such as organophosphates (insecticides, DDT, etc.) or nerve types of agents such as mustard gas and so forth. Did the house or in particular that room get sprayed or treated in the past 1-2 days with pesticides or herbicides for any reason? That might be the most likely source of the problem if it's not coming from a kitchen appliance or other open source.
The symptoms you mention suggest overstimulation of what are called both muscarinic and nicotinic acetylcholine receptors due to the BLOCKADE of an enzyme called acetylcholinesterase.
Clearly, staying in an environment with high predilection to overstimulate the acetylcholine receptors in the body will send the autonomic nervous system into essential overdrive without the necessary antagonism to bring it down. The eventual result can be severe cardiac and respiratory complications resulting in paralysis and spasming of muscles with death to follow if the exposure is to high or concentrations without ventilation of the space. Under no circumstance should you or anyone return to this environment until the source of the problem has been located.
Have a SAFE New Year and Good Luck. I'd be interested in any followup you might have on this situation.
If this information has been helpful and I've answered your questions would you do me the favor of some written feedback and a STAR RATING of the answer.
Should you have no further questions or comments to place- CLOSING THE QUERY would be greatly appreciated as well.
In the future I'm happy to answer more concerns personally if you'd allow me this privilege by going to the following website and sending me your questions:
bit.ly/drdariushsaghafi
This query required 58 minutes of physician specific review, research, and final draft documentation for envoy.
Fire Dept.- Health Dept.- Gas Company Most Indicated
Detailed Answer:
Good afternoon. My name is Dr. Saghafi and I am a neurologist from XXXXXXX Ohio. Sorry to hear you're having these sorts of issues. You say that PECO (I'm not sure what the acronym stands for) and the Fire Dept. have reviewed the premises but not found CO.
However, in my opinion they would be the ultimate authorities for the job of either finding the cause of this problem in this house or at least verifying that something toxic is present and to implement actions to remedy the situation. Obviously, from a medical or neurological point of view nobody should be in this environment until it has been cleared and the problem corrected. Perhaps, the State has a HAZMAT Dept. that can be dispatched to the premisis if the other authorities can't think of anything? Of course, I'm sure nobody is going to make you go back in the house unless it's been cleared. How about the EPA?
As far as what the substance is causing these symptoms it almost certainly is NOT carbon monoxide (CO). Typically, that substance will make people lightheaded, dizzy, and nauseous or suffer with what is taken to be flu like symptoms but drooling, chest tightness, or complaints of chemical tastes in the mouth are not part of the common clinical presentation. Though CO is naturally an odorless gas typically, the smell of natural gas in a room always implies the presence of CO.
The one substance that comes to my mind when you talk about drooling and chest tightness, and shakiness in the hands, weakness in the knees, would be substances such as organophosphates (insecticides, DDT, etc.) or nerve types of agents such as mustard gas and so forth. Did the house or in particular that room get sprayed or treated in the past 1-2 days with pesticides or herbicides for any reason? That might be the most likely source of the problem if it's not coming from a kitchen appliance or other open source.
The symptoms you mention suggest overstimulation of what are called both muscarinic and nicotinic acetylcholine receptors due to the BLOCKADE of an enzyme called acetylcholinesterase.
Clearly, staying in an environment with high predilection to overstimulate the acetylcholine receptors in the body will send the autonomic nervous system into essential overdrive without the necessary antagonism to bring it down. The eventual result can be severe cardiac and respiratory complications resulting in paralysis and spasming of muscles with death to follow if the exposure is to high or concentrations without ventilation of the space. Under no circumstance should you or anyone return to this environment until the source of the problem has been located.
Have a SAFE New Year and Good Luck. I'd be interested in any followup you might have on this situation.
If this information has been helpful and I've answered your questions would you do me the favor of some written feedback and a STAR RATING of the answer.
Should you have no further questions or comments to place- CLOSING THE QUERY would be greatly appreciated as well.
In the future I'm happy to answer more concerns personally if you'd allow me this privilege by going to the following website and sending me your questions:
bit.ly/drdariushsaghafi
This query required 58 minutes of physician specific review, research, and final draft documentation for envoy.
Above answer was peer-reviewed by :
Dr. Prasad
Sir,
Thank you for your prompt response. I had recommended the EPA as I couldn't think of another agency as well. PECO is the local gas company. I am passing your notes onto XXXXXXX and will keep you updated.
Sincerely,
XXXXXXXX
Thank you for your prompt response. I had recommended the EPA as I couldn't think of another agency as well. PECO is the local gas company. I am passing your notes onto XXXXXXX and will keep you updated.
Sincerely,
XXXXXXXX
Brief Answer:
Surprised that Fire Dept didn't suggest anything
Detailed Answer:
Thanks for your return response.
I hope everyone is safe. I take it there's been no resolution to figuring out what in the heck is in that house or that room. Is it really the only room in the house that is like that? Because that is very odd. Even more odd to me is the fact that if the Fire Dept couldn't figure out anything that they shouldn't've bumped the issue up to the next level. How can they allow toxic fumes to be present in a living environment or place where people could potentially go into and even fall asleep or whatever? That could be disastrous.
Those are really the only things I can think of in terms of contacting agencies.
Also, hopefully, the information on the types of probable substances you're dealing with in the environment based upon your symptoms may give the agency involved some clue as to what to look for when they go in there or inspect around the premises.
I'd be most interested in learning the final results of what happened in this case in terms of what they found and where the substance was coming from. In the mean time, stay clear of that area until you get a green light to go back in...something's not right.
If this information has been helpful and I've answered your questions would you do me the favor of some written feedback and a STAR RATING of the answer.
Should you have no further questions or comments to place- CLOSING THE QUERY would be greatly appreciated as well.
In the future I'm happy to answer more concerns personally if you'd allow me this privilege by going to the following website and sending me your questions:
bit.ly/drdariushsaghafi
This query has required 71 minutes TOTAL TIME of physician specific review, research, and final draft documentation for envoy.
Surprised that Fire Dept didn't suggest anything
Detailed Answer:
Thanks for your return response.
I hope everyone is safe. I take it there's been no resolution to figuring out what in the heck is in that house or that room. Is it really the only room in the house that is like that? Because that is very odd. Even more odd to me is the fact that if the Fire Dept couldn't figure out anything that they shouldn't've bumped the issue up to the next level. How can they allow toxic fumes to be present in a living environment or place where people could potentially go into and even fall asleep or whatever? That could be disastrous.
Those are really the only things I can think of in terms of contacting agencies.
Also, hopefully, the information on the types of probable substances you're dealing with in the environment based upon your symptoms may give the agency involved some clue as to what to look for when they go in there or inspect around the premises.
I'd be most interested in learning the final results of what happened in this case in terms of what they found and where the substance was coming from. In the mean time, stay clear of that area until you get a green light to go back in...something's not right.
If this information has been helpful and I've answered your questions would you do me the favor of some written feedback and a STAR RATING of the answer.
Should you have no further questions or comments to place- CLOSING THE QUERY would be greatly appreciated as well.
In the future I'm happy to answer more concerns personally if you'd allow me this privilege by going to the following website and sending me your questions:
bit.ly/drdariushsaghafi
This query has required 71 minutes TOTAL TIME of physician specific review, research, and final draft documentation for envoy.
Above answer was peer-reviewed by :
Dr. Vinay Bhardwaj
Good Morning, Sir.
We've found the culprit. Paint. Professionals with proper breathing equipment will be removing it. The installation of a new boiler system caused the heat in the storage area to rise which in turn placed old paint cans that were stored there to heat up. That released vapors into the enclosed space which seeped through the floor boards. We will be taking a picture of the ingredients and going to the doctor for further evaluation. You have helped immensely in locating the potential cause. Both the local gas company and the local fire dept tested the area, but did not find a root cause. Your possible assessment gave us guidance on what it could possibly be and we started looking downstairs, where the paint was found.
Again, I thank you for your assistance. You nailed it.
Sincerely,
XXXXXX
We've found the culprit. Paint. Professionals with proper breathing equipment will be removing it. The installation of a new boiler system caused the heat in the storage area to rise which in turn placed old paint cans that were stored there to heat up. That released vapors into the enclosed space which seeped through the floor boards. We will be taking a picture of the ingredients and going to the doctor for further evaluation. You have helped immensely in locating the potential cause. Both the local gas company and the local fire dept tested the area, but did not find a root cause. Your possible assessment gave us guidance on what it could possibly be and we started looking downstairs, where the paint was found.
Again, I thank you for your assistance. You nailed it.
Sincerely,
XXXXXX
Brief Answer:
Holy Paint Thinner and Creeping Gases said the Boy Wonder!
Detailed Answer:
Well, I'm so happy you found the problem. I had been thinking about things all week and was sorry I hadn't suggested that line of products because benzenes and petroleum based products (paints, varnishes, etc) could do the same. I didn't suspect that they were being activated that way by heat. You are lucky that a fire didn't get started down there.
Wow! Amazing story. I'm glad you felt there was some benefit to the information I provided though I'm still shaking my head that the initial calls you put in to experts whose business it is to know this stuff backward and forward seem to have dropped the ball. Well, all's well that end's well I guess and it's just a relief that nothing really bad happened to anybody.
Your comments are greatly appreciated. If the information truly helped then, you've made my day and I've learned something from this case as well....so THANK YOU for the follow up.
Just as a reminder I'm happy to answer more questions as a neurologist/headache specialist or other type if you think I can help by looking me up at:
bit.ly/drdariushsaghafi
This query has required 85 minutes TOTAL TIME of physician specific review, research, and final draft documentation for envoy.
Cheers!
Holy Paint Thinner and Creeping Gases said the Boy Wonder!
Detailed Answer:
Well, I'm so happy you found the problem. I had been thinking about things all week and was sorry I hadn't suggested that line of products because benzenes and petroleum based products (paints, varnishes, etc) could do the same. I didn't suspect that they were being activated that way by heat. You are lucky that a fire didn't get started down there.
Wow! Amazing story. I'm glad you felt there was some benefit to the information I provided though I'm still shaking my head that the initial calls you put in to experts whose business it is to know this stuff backward and forward seem to have dropped the ball. Well, all's well that end's well I guess and it's just a relief that nothing really bad happened to anybody.
Your comments are greatly appreciated. If the information truly helped then, you've made my day and I've learned something from this case as well....so THANK YOU for the follow up.
Just as a reminder I'm happy to answer more questions as a neurologist/headache specialist or other type if you think I can help by looking me up at:
bit.ly/drdariushsaghafi
This query has required 85 minutes TOTAL TIME of physician specific review, research, and final draft documentation for envoy.
Cheers!
Above answer was peer-reviewed by :
Dr. Raju A.T
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